The Sinclair QL Forum

Hello everyone,
Does anyone know what the legal status of Hermes is? Has the code (or even better, source) been made publicly available?

After some prodding by me the binaries have been released under the GPL. I needed it for the QL MiSTer implementation because the original 8049 code had problems with key-rollover and the missing keystrokes drove me mad.

The same is theoretically true for the source code, but Lau has it somewhere in storage with no immediate way to access it... eventually I plan to prod some more.

That's great news actually though prices of 8749 have gone crazy. Original IPS should really be forgotten.
I would love to see Lau's original sources as they are always so nicely commented. It should be possible to re-create it for a mor emodern RISC based 8-bit MPU like AVR...

Nasta wrote:Hello everyone,
Does anyone know what the legal status of Hermes is? Has the code (or even better, source) been made publicly available?

Not sure if this is what you meant, Nasta (I missed this message originally), there is a commented Hermes disassembly on my site at http://www.dilwyn.me.uk/qlrom/ipc8049.zip

dilwyn wrote:

Nasta wrote:Hello everyone,
Does anyone know what the legal status of Hermes is? Has the code (or even better, source) been made publicly available?

Not sure if this is what you meant, Nasta (I missed this message originally), there is a commented Hermes disassembly on my site at http://www.dilwyn.me.uk/qlrom/ipc8049.zip

EDIT: sorry misunderstood, this is 8049, not Hermes. Sorry again.

Brane2 wrote:

Nasta wrote:That's great news actually though prices of 8749 have gone crazy. Original IPS should really be forgotten.
I would love to see Lau's original sources as they are always so nicely commented. It should be possible to re-create it for a mor emodern RISC based 8-bit MPU like AVR...

HAsn't this been done ? Ithought there already was an implementation with PIC that could do PS/2 etc along the way...

Yes, it was a small board with a PIC that scanned the 8049 keyboard scanning lines and emulated keypresses based on data received from a PC (PS2) keyboard. I seem to remember there was a problem with it on Hermes as Hermes did things a bit differently in order to get proper rollover and other stuff right.

Brane2 wrote:Oh, you are thinking about historically semi-accurate 1:1 replacement with available off-the-shelf chip ?

Something in that vein, yes. Preferably replacing the IPC and the 8302...

Brane2 wrote:BTW, not all for 8749 prices are that completely crazy:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/321267189057?h ... SwQ25b5EJI
and this one couldn't be better even in QL's days:
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005002 ... ca5f4204-7

Buying semiconductors from China is like a box of chocolates, you never know what you are going to get... These days it's much more difficult doing the 'well, it's only a few $ so buy, test and see, buy more if good' because now even 1$ shipments from AliExpress get a 3-4EUR customs processing fee IF you are not asked to provide a bill so that customs duty can be added (YES for $1), and even if the chip or whatever proves to be good, there is absolutely no guarantee the next time you order from the same supplier you will get the same thing.
This is particularly horrible with audio power transistors and audio semiconductors in general and the next on the list are various MPUs and MCUs. I once ordered 10 transistors of a certain kind and while they all had the same markings, there were actually 7 different kinds of transistors, NONE were what it said on the case (some even had subtle differences in case style hinting at different types and manufacturers right from the start). These same sellers are selling the same crap on eBay and Ali years later. The worst kind of offence was re-marking genuine ultrarare and expensive transistors as cheaper ultra rare transistors (which is OK for me when I figure it out but completely stupid if the seller is obviously trying to cheat. Well - let me take that back a notch. The _sellers_ themselves usually have no idea they are selling trash because they have no idea what they are selling. They are just a front end for a bigger operation. Tons of stories like that including documentation... these days if you don't have some serious test gear you better not mess with power semiconductors. Or, as I have been known to do, take a hammer with you when going to the local electronic parts shop, buy the piece, smash it outside on the curb and make sure the insides are what they are supposed to be, then go back in and either curse or buy more, depending on what you found.

Hi,

Great news, I can legally replace the 8049 with Hermes on all my QLs.


The 8049 chips, will in a box withe the microdrives...

Nasta wrote:That's great news actually though prices of 8749 have gone crazy. Original IPS should really be forgotten.

I ordered 5 for 10€ from eBay. Of course they were used but easily erased

I would love to see Lau's original sources as they are always so nicely commented. It should be possible to re-create it for a mor emodern RISC based 8-bit MPU like AVR...

Yes, that was the main reason I wanted the source code, it's always a good read. Of course there is also the SuperHermes, which is already an adaption of the IPC for the PIC processor line, but unfortunately that code is missing, too.

mk79 wrote:

Nasta wrote:That's great news actually though prices of 8749 have gone crazy. Original IPS should really be forgotten.

I ordered 5 for 10€ from eBay. Of course they were used but easily erased

No problem with that, as long as it works. BTW does the TL866 programmer program them (or is the programming voltage too high?)

I would love to see Lau's original sources as they are always so nicely commented. It should be possible to re-create it for a more modern RISC based 8-bit MPU like AVR...

Yes, that was the main reason I wanted the source code, it's always a good read. Of course there is also the SuperHermes, which is already an adaption of the IPC for the PIC processor line, but unfortunately that code is missing, too.

Unfortunately that one suffered from a missing PIC too, for some reason Microchip stopped making them while superHermes was still made. That being said, one of my regular 'old chips' provider in Germany had an auction for something like 2 tubes full of the PLCC version. That code would be great to have, given a LOT of work has been done to cram it full of features, anything but trivial to code.

Nasta wrote:No problem with that, as long as it works. BTW does the TL866 programmer program them (or is the programming voltage too high?)

I don't think any commercial programmer newer than 20 years supports this chip, mostly due to the voltages I guess. I build one myself instead http://www.mattmillman.com/projects/hve ... er-reader/ (haven't soldered this much through-hole in a long time...)

I would love to see Lau's original sources as they are always so nicely commented. It should be possible to re-create it for a more modern RISC based 8-bit MPU like AVR...

Yes, that was the main reason I wanted the source code, it's always a good read. Of course there is also the SuperHermes, which is already an adaption of the IPC for the PIC processor line, but unfortunately that code is missing, too.

Unfortunately that one suffered from a missing PIC too, for some reason Microchip stopped making them while superHermes was still made. That being said, one of my regular 'old chips' provider in Germany had an auction for something like 2 tubes full of the PLCC version. That code would be great to have, given a LOT of work has been done to cram it full of features, anything but trivial to code.

I've heard crazy stories that Lau had to work around problems in the PIC processor which Microchip even acknowledged in their errata some time later. But all will be in assembler I fear, so porting it to anything else will always be somewhat of a pain.