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Re: SOLVED !! smsq/e on rom
Posted: Thu Jun 12, 2025 6:36 pm
by Derek_Stewart
tofro wrote: Thu Jun 12, 2025 5:36 pm
Would SMSQ/E Gold (with a GoldCard) loaded from Tony Firshman's ROMDISQ count? Then we already have (had) it.
I tried to remake the Romdisq under Licence from Tony Firshman. But it seems after all the legal issues were sorted out, the design files were not available due a PC with the data, being thrown away.
So unless Tony finds a backup of the data, the Romdisq, could one of those nice things to have but not available.
I have a faulty Romdisq, which Tony could not repair, maybe the PCB could reverse engineered, but the PLD code will be protected. So not much hope.
Best to use QIMSI, though the ROM_LOAD command to load ROMs into the QL ROM space is missing.
Pity Marcel's QLSD wasn't was not available, I made another yet offer to build the hardware, which denied.
Maybe I should give up this hardware building and go back to drinking beer...
Re: SOLVED !! smsq/e on rom
Posted: Sat Jun 14, 2025 9:06 am
by Tinyfpga
Posted by Wicksy » Mon Jun 09, 2025 12:59 pm
Would SMS2 work natively on the QL? With no basic interpreter it must be smaller, but am
guessing it only works with some software for this reason.
And:-
Posted by Derek_Stewart » Thu Jun 12, 2025 3:59 pm
SMS2 only runs on an Atari ST series.
SMS2 also runs natively on a Mist FPGA. The SMS2 128K PEROM also runs in a PC emulator called Steem.
The mist is now unavailable. The emulation is interesting because it is currently the easiest way of using the operating system. SMS2 was originally delivered in 128k bytes of PEROM (Programmable Erasable Read Only Memory).
The interpreter was replaced with a QD/Liberator Integrated development system that I still use today in both SMS2 and SMSQE. It is a method of programming in BASIC that I find easier to use than the various interpreted BASIC programming methods that are available in SMSQE.
Anyhow, as Derek writes, SMS2 is not for use in a QL and the best way to run SMSQE in a QL is to buy a QIMSI.
Re: SOLVED !! smsq/e on rom
Posted: Sat Jun 14, 2025 9:31 am
by Derek_Stewart
Tinyfpga wrote: Sat Jun 14, 2025 9:06 am
Posted by Wicksy » Mon Jun 09, 2025 12:59 pm
Would SMS2 work natively on the QL? With no basic interpreter it must be smaller, but am
guessing it only works with some software for this reason.
And:-
Posted by Derek_Stewart » Thu Jun 12, 2025 3:59 pm
SMS2 only runs on an Atari ST series.
SMS2 also runs natively on a Mist FPGA. The SMS2 128K PEROM also runs in a PC emulator called Steem.
Steem.JPG
The mist is now unavailable. The emulation is interesting because it is currently the easiest way of using the operating system. SMS2 was originally delivered in 128k bytes of PEROM (Programmable Erasable Read Only Memory).
The interpreter was replaced with a QD/Liberator Integrated development system that I still use today in both SMS2 and SMSQE. It is a method of programming in BASIC that I find easier to use than the various interpreted BASIC programming methods that are available in SMSQE.
Anyhow, as Derek writes, SMS2 is not for use in a QL and the best way to run SMSQE in a QL is to buy a QIMSI.
STEEM is an Atari ST emulation system.
SMS2 is an earlier version of SMSQ/E, written by Tony Tebby, will only run on Atari ST based computers including the MEGA, TT030.
SMSQ/E will run on a QL with a Super Gold Card or Gold Card, which the QIMSI Gold gives Gold Card speed and functionality. This is called SMSQ/E Gold.
I can not afford a MIST system, but the Q68 is half the price and run SMSQ/E in many video modes.
Re: SOLVED !! smsq/e on rom
Posted: Sat Jun 14, 2025 10:09 am
by tofro
Derek,
note the MIST (originally developed by Till Harbaum) and the MISTer (a port of the very same thing not on proprietary hardware, but to an officially available commercial (but expensive) development board are two very different things, both in price and capability.
The MIST used to be a lot cheaper than the MISTer, around the Q68 price.
Re: SOLVED !! smsq/e on rom
Posted: Sat Jun 14, 2025 10:55 am
by Peter
tofro wrote: Thu Jun 12, 2025 5:36 pm
Would SMSQ/E Gold (with a GoldCard) loaded from Tony Firshman's ROMDISQ count? Then we already have (had) it.
I still have it
If a system with separate CPU counts: QIMSI Gold has onboard Flash ROM, too.
Only a small portion of those 4 MB is needed by the FPGA and could be used for storage.
If it doesn't have to be a full filesystem, just a loader for SMSQ/E, that's something I could probably write in an hour.
Re: SOLVED !! smsq/e on rom
Posted: Sat Jun 14, 2025 11:05 am
by Peter
Tinyfpga wrote: Sat Jun 14, 2025 9:06 am
SMS2 also runs natively on a Mist FPGA.
But not with the QL core I guess?
Tinyfpga wrote: Sat Jun 14, 2025 9:06 am
The interpreter was replaced with a QD/Liberator Integrated development system that I still use today in both SMS2 and SMSQE.
That sounds like QLiberator. Was it essentially the same?
Re: SOLVED !! smsq/e on rom
Posted: Sat Jun 14, 2025 12:24 pm
by desin
Hi
Sorry to interrupt the discussion
SMS2 was designt to run on a Atari ST/STE (STACY/TT ?)
Yes it runs on a MIST/MISTER and on various platforms under Hatari/Steem
but
it is nearly impossible to write on any medium
for floppy disk supportis handled through .ST/.MSA containers
for hard disk support there is also no raw access
Markus
Re: SOLVED !! smsq/e on rom
Posted: Sat Jun 14, 2025 1:53 pm
by RalfR
My version of SMS2 (disk based) can write to QL formated disks.
Re: SOLVED !! smsq/e on rom
Posted: Sat Jun 14, 2025 2:13 pm
by Tinyfpga
Posted by Peter » Sat Jun 14, 2025 11:05 am
But not with the QL core I guess?
It runs on the Atari ST core, but I would love to see SMS2 running on your FPGA boards.
That sounds like QLiberator. Was it essentially the same?
I suppose it is/was, but the SMS2 parser (BASIC) seems more reliable than the SMSQE parser (QBASIC). I have created a Hard disk container holding various QD/BASIC and help setups. I prefer the original SMS2 version.
------------
Posted by desin » Sat Jun 14, 2025 12:24
it is nearly impossible to write on any medium
for floppy disk support is handled through .ST/.MSA containers.
On Steem I use the virtual floppies created by QPC2 to transfer files to/from SMSQE to SMS2. I have forgotten how I did this on my Mist because I havent used it in a long time. I don't remember it being difficult.
Re: SOLVED !! smsq/e on rom
Posted: Sat Jun 14, 2025 3:41 pm
by Peter
Tinyfpga wrote: Sat Jun 14, 2025 2:13 pm
It runs on the Atari ST core, but I would love to see SMS2 running on your FPGA boards.
I did successfully try open source PC/AT and Z80 FPGA implementations on my boards, so Atari would also not be rocket science.
Just glad that Markus warned about the mass storage issue. Good reason to better invest my QL time differently.
Another thing is: My boards have no external CPU to easily swap FPGA cores. They were designed for QL-only use.
Qzero/QIMSI Gold allow FPGA field updates, but those happen under SMSQ/E with the update software running on the FPGA CPU.
I would not want to also write such software for Atari, so everyone can easily go back to the QL-style core.